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Author
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Topic: Senator comtenplates legislation on OAD rule
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UNC-HEELS
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Member # 2523
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posted 04-22-2015 11:39 AM
[URL=http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/govt-and-politics/gateway-to-dc/mccaskill-contemplating-legislative-action-on-ncaa-one-and-done-rule/article_c7ebcb03-f84f-5fa3-8634-9ae8648 e911a]http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/govt-and-politics/gateway-to-dc/mccaskill-contemplating-legislative-action-on-ncaa-one-and-done-rule/article_c7ebcb03-f84f-5fa3-8634-9ae864 8e911a[/URL] .html
It is no secret to anyone on this board how opposed I am to OAD's be it UK, DUKE, UNC, or any of the other programs. I know some maybe all on this board disagree and that's fine, but not my point here.
It has been in part due to this rule that I have lost my passion over the college game and have long since stopped watching the NBA (for other reasons other than the OAD rule)
However, as much as I may agree with the senators opinion, and as much as I would like the see the OAD rule abolished, I am not comfortable with the government getting involved with college athletics on this level.
The framework is already in place for the NCAA to curb OAD's even if the NBA will not.
AS I have said on many occasions, if the NCAA is so concerned about OAD's (which we all know is not the case) then simply reinstate the "Freshman Rule."
Either the prospects will sign for two years or they will find another way to the NBA by playing overseas or some other approach. But we all know too well the NCAA is about the all mighty dollar and the term "student athlete" is a farce.
None the less, IMO the government needs to "butt out" of this issue.
[ 04-22-2015, 11:42 AM: Message edited by: UNC-HEELS ]
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PaulCat
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posted 04-22-2015 12:04 PM
I'm not opposed to OAD's. I'm opposed to OAD's who really aren't ready to be done but leave anyway.
The freshman rule is a joke and isn't the answer to this issue. I don't even know why this is ever mentioned.
To me, the issue lies with the NBA. Do they really like wasting their money on these kids who leave early and don't pan out? If I was an NBA owner whose team was competing each year for championships, and I had one of the last picks of the first round, I'd simply pass. I wouldn't select anyone. As long as the NBA keeps drafting kids who aren't sure-fire picks based on potential, this problem will not go away.
Posts: 10347 | From: Erlanger, Ky. USA | Registered: Mar 2000
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UNC-HEELS
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Member # 2523
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posted 04-22-2015 12:37 PM
Paulcat,
My problem is with the NCAA and OAD's. Lets not pretend these kids are coming to college for an education. (referring to the elite kids here)
You and I both know that is not the case. These kids are only coming to the universities to "showcase" their talent and "position" themselves for the draft.
There is nothing these kids are doing that is about true academics and education.
Not everyone is made for college. But for any institution today to attempt to hold these kids to "academic standards" is a joke in of itself, be it UNC, be it UK, or DUKE!
It is more about who can bring in the best "ringer" and win games. And IMO that creates a whole lot of other issues that are ruining the college game. At the beginning of the season it was pretty much already known it was between UK and Duke for the title, on paper.
I am sick of the NBA using the college programs as their farm teams, and I sick of the NCAA pretending it is all about "student athletes" and academics when that is simply not the case.
At least the NCAA could show some honesty and when the OAD's attend college, GIVE them a curriculum that involves nothing more a class on basketball history. Because no one is buying that these kids are going after a "real major" to begin with other than basically "declaring" for a major they will never even actually start.
I guess Paulcat I am tired of the hypocrisy of the NCAA and NBA on this issue, the deception behind the scenes at all these programs that are claiming these kids are "student athletes" when they are nothing more than "transients" on the way to the NBA, and would not even be there in the first place if they were not REQUIRED to do so.
I hate the NBA and the college game is now starting to look a lot like it in some ways.
None the less I know we disagree, but that's ok, it makes for good discussion since the season for real sports is over.
But actually my main point was the government possibly getting involved in the issue, which I am opposed to. I do believe our government has far more pressing issues on their plates than to be concerned with OAD's in the college programs.
[ 04-22-2015, 12:38 PM: Message edited by: UNC-HEELS ]
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Tiptree
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Member # 844
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posted 04-22-2015 01:14 PM
Heels,
Perhaps the scandal at UNC has jaded you, but most of the "one and done" players that Cal recruits go to class, do well (team GPA is over 3.0), and finish the spring semester even if they declare for the draft. That is why UK has one of the highest APR scores in the NCAA; Cal has a passion for keeping kids on track for graduation. Despite the hate-filled rants of Bobby Knight, only one UK OAD player did not attend class after the season ended (Orton), and nobody expected him to even declare.
The thing that most people miss is that Cal recruits character first, and he recruits kids whose parents are deeply involved in their kid's lives and education. Yes, the really good ones leave early for NBA riches, but even those tend to come back and finish their degrees.
Don't be so hasty to cast a pall over everyone. There are some good kids out there.
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Tiptree
“If a nation expects to be ignorant and free, in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be.” Thomas Jefferson
Posts: 13628 | From: Terre Haute, IN | Registered: Sep 2000
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catmandoo
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Member # 1284
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posted 04-22-2015 01:14 PM
I agree with vigor this statement made by UNC-HEELS:
But actually my main point was the government possibly getting involved in the issue, which I am opposed to. I do believe our government has far more pressing issues on their plates than to be concerned with OAD's in the college programs.
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Posts: 186359 | From: st. augustine florida 32092 | Registered: Mar 2001
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PaulCat
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Member # 513
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posted 04-22-2015 01:58 PM
Heels, I'll be the first one to agree that these kids don't want to be in school. But there's no better option right now than to go to college for a year or two - that's what the NBA rule is forcing.
My problem is that there are too many kids that are leaving college who don't pan out in the NBA. The NBA simply needs a true "minor league" where these kids can go and make a living instead of going to college. If that is the D-League, then the NBA needs to start going after these kids in high school.
Posts: 10347 | From: Erlanger, Ky. USA | Registered: Mar 2000
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WHO?UK
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Member # 2286
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posted 04-22-2015 02:17 PM
One and done rule is the NBA players union rule... It is not an NCAA rule... If the NCAA did make it a rule, I'm sure those kids would just go overseas for a year. Either way the NCAA loses.
I'd like to see NBA and NCAA come to an agreement like the MLB and College Baseball. If a kid wants to enter the draft, let him. If he doesn't like his draft slot he can opt out and go to college for a minimum of two years before being eligible to enter the draft again.
Again at the end of the day there is too much money overseas to keep these kids from going to college if there was a two year minimum.
To add to what Paul said... When China, Europe and South America is paying guys well over 6 figures to play ball the decision is easy. I know college is great but when you are offered that kind of money out of High School you should be able to support yourself and pay for college later. If they are not responsible enough to manage there money, what makes you think they will be responsible enough to graduate from college.
[ 04-22-2015, 02:22 PM: Message edited by: WHO?UK ]
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RLTW!
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Trey Ball
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Member # 332
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posted 04-22-2015 02:49 PM
UNC-Heels,
A lot of kids playing college basketball for 4 years are not in it for the academics. That is why many of them never get a degree so to isolate the one and done in the way you are is a gross error IMO.
Brandon Knight was Valedictorian of his High School and maintained a perfect GPA in high school and at UK. So he obviously took his academics seriously as did Anthony Davis, who attended an ACADEMIC school in Chicago, not one of the basketball factories. Alex Poythress will graduate with an Accounting degree in just 3 years. He couldn't have done that by not taking his academics seriously. I'm sure there are examples of some one and done's at UK that didn't take it as seriously as well, just like their are some kids who never had a chance to be a one and done haven't taken it seriously.
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redbone
Posts: 11568 | From: IN, USA | Registered: Dec 1999
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UNC-HEELS
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Member # 2523
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posted 04-22-2015 05:09 PM
I certainly understand all of your viewpoints, I do, how ever, IMO, these kids, the elites would not be in college at all if not for the NBA age rule and NCAA allowing freshmen to play.
I know I mention the NCAA and the freshmen rule a lot.
But, the point I attempt to make with that is the fact if the NCAA were really all that concerned about the OAD's and student academics and the "student athlete" they could reinstitute the freshmen rule.
But to do so may affect the revenue stream the NCAA is currently enjoying. All I am saying in all this is, YES it is a NBA rule, but for the NCAA to say they have ZERO options, is a ruse at best.
I do not think all the kids that get a scholly for a program is only there for basketball.
AOD's like that of Oakafor that stated before the season ever started he was there for only one year.
Are we to really believe that he was concerned about academics other than to meet the NCAA requirement for eligibility? That to me is not what I would consider a "student athlete."
I guess I just miss the college game the way it once was when loyalty did count for something. The conferences were not "super conferences." Now the college game is a reflection of the NBA and both IMO are suffering as of the quality.
Now days when a player I like jumps to the NBA, I am done. I could care less where or what he does in the NBA.
Now here is something I read that I could support, however I think any one with common sense knows this is nothing but a pipe dream at best but was interesting:
Here are four things the NCAA could do to put student back in student-athlete.
1. Make a scholarship to a freshman count in the total number of scholarships used for the next three years unless the student graduates early. This would reduce the incentive for coaches to recruit students who plan to leave school before completing their graduation requirements.
2. Require schools to submit a program of study showing how the student is on track to graduate at the conclusion of their eligibility. The plan can have no more that 39 credit hours per year, 15 in the fall and spring semesters and 9 in the summer. Students who are not on track will be ineligible. This reduces the incentive to use easy courses to boost GPA if the course does not move the student towards completing the degree.
3. Develop and administer competency exams for student-athletes. Investigate the courses taken if the percentage of student-athletes who do not meet minimum competency is too high to determine if the course meets academic standards for college credit. If not, remove the grades in the courses from the calculation of GPA. This removes the incentives for instructors to favor student-athletes with inflated grades or to offer courses with little content or challenge.
4. Make freshmen ineligible, at least for the revenue sports. This would reduce the incentive for coaches to recruit students who plan to leave school before completing their graduation requirements.
But that just ain't ever gonna happen.
By the way, did I mention the senator that was suggesting the possibility of creating legislation to do away with OAD's was a.......
Each to his own and I can appreciate that.
[ 04-22-2015, 05:23 PM: Message edited by: UNC-HEELS ]
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WHO?UK
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posted 04-22-2015 07:41 PM
"I'm a top college recruit... Go to college and not play ball for a year, or go to Europe, China or South America for 1 year making anywhere from 300,000$ to over a million and then go to the NBA. Maybe getting my college degree isn't my dream but playing in the NBA is. Just because getting a college degree for most people is the right answer, it does not necessarily make it right for me."
Lebron James made 127 million from Nike before he ever stepped on a NBA court. Sebastian Telfair made like 6 million from Adidas before ever playing in the NBA. Just because they don't work out all the time in the NBA like my example of Sebastian... He was offered 7 million to stay on the team he was playing for in China.
I'm sorry but if God gave me the ability to play basketball like Sebastian or any other upcoming stud and I could make millions. You can keep your college and I'll make enough money that if I ever want or need to go to college, I could go and take my entire family with me.
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RLTW!
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ALA_KAT2
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posted 04-22-2015 11:28 PM
The college game will never be like it was in the "old days". Yes, I would like to see the Freshman rule put back in or the NBA require a kid to be 21 before they would draft him. But in reality, as many of you mention, the almighty BUCK had ruined the college game. Why can't it be like the days of Issel, Dampier, Greevy, Givens and Macy. Those guys were great players who stayed FOUR years and we're not lured by the almighty BUCK to leave school early for the NBA (or ABA). Weren't they good enough? Yes, I think do, but the whole mindset and culture were different back then. The name on the front of the jersey meant something. Now kids come to KY to play for a coach who will get them to the league ASAP. Not to play for Kentucky so much. Rant over!
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Adair CHS 1966/USAF/WKU/AT&T
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WHO?UK
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posted 04-23-2015 07:11 AM
I'll admit it is hurting College basketball but my finger is pointed only at the NBA. ALACat you are right it would take the NBA instituting an age limit. But I've seen NBA teams and scouts hold it against guys for being in College for four years. The way they see it, that's two or three years he could of been in the league playing for them. Instead that extra wear and tear on the kids body isn't worth the risk because they got six more younger studs to choose from.
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RLTW!
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boomdaddy
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posted 04-23-2015 07:51 AM
I am in the camp that is for the major conferences pulling out of the NCAA and starting their own league. Piss on the money hungry NCAA and their two faced, pious authority. They rake in all the profits and piss on the athletes.
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catmandoo
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posted 04-23-2015 08:49 AM
Why can't the NBA and the NCAA get together and work things out where it would benefit the players always thinking about themselves.
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Bama Cat
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Member # 153
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posted 04-23-2015 11:25 AM
I still can't get away from the 2 year scholarship. When they sign for 2 years their contract with the school says they will be there for 2 years but if they decide to leave before the end of 2 years it will stipulate in the contract how much they must pay the school for the 2 years they signed for. I realize that a few of these guys will leave after 1 year and be a top draft in the NBA and sign for big bucks and could afford to pay the school with some of their first year salary. But the average good player, such as Dakari or the Harrisons who don't look to get a guaranteed salary would not leave school before 2 years. If they were to also allow kids to go in the draft out of high school and not get drafted allow them to return to college. I think everyone needs a safety line.
Posts: 14172 | From: berea, ky, usa | Registered: Sep 1999
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m hamilton
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posted 04-24-2015 06:03 AM
THing of it is, Bama, they don't even have to sign a scholarship letter of intent.
What was it Brandon Knight signed the year he came to KY?
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Bama Cat
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posted 04-24-2015 10:12 AM
Yeah I forgot about that. I still think it would be better if we went back to having JV teams. If they are good enough let them go to the NBA out of high school. If they're not that good then have a JV team for freshmen.
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